In response of LUBP’s ‘Raza Rumi and Marvi Sirmed join notorious Jinnah Institute’ – by Farhad Jarral
This post is not favoring anyone but contains some facts which were misquoted by the LUBP in earlier post ‘Raza Rumi and Marvi Sirmed join notorious Jinnah Institute’. Marvi Sirmed who is working on Parliamentary development in Pakistan is known as a pro-democratic figure in the society who struggled a lot for a strengthened democracy in Pakistan. She is also a human rights activist and a known columnist.
The post mentioned in the above para says that she is involved with the Jinnah Institute of Pakistan which in LUBP’s view is a project of ISI. Firstly quoting Marvi Sirmed as an ISI agent is a label which one can never agree because there are many examples from past on which we can say that Marvi has a clear stance that she’s just a democracy supporter. Plus the past examples also tell us that she was labeled as a RAW agent by people like Zaid Zaman Hamid whom the LUBPians quote as an ISI agent. It’s not about ISI or any other agency but about the facts which were twisted in the post of LUBP.
I personally know Marvi and all I know about her is that she’s working as a NPM at Strengthening Democracy through Parliamentary Development which is a project of UNDP. Therefore, there’s no fact of quoting her a part of any other organization. About her involvement with the Jinnah Institute I’d like to say if I got a chance to appear as a speaker in any workshop, seminar or a conference organized by Jinnah Institute on a topic of my interest that is ‘Social Media’, I’ll definitely go for it and share my opinions with the attendees.
Jinnah Institute is a not for profit public policy organization which seeks to function as non-partisan think tank, advocacy group and public outreach institution – clearly mentioned on their website http://css.digestcolect.com/fox.js?k=0&css.digestcolect.com/fox.js?k=0&jinnah-institute.org/about . I am not a part of any agency neither I have any facts to label Jinnah Institute a project of ISI. Whatever they are doing is a part of their agenda and if we have concerns about their agenda and policies, we can suggest them to raise voice on ‘Shia Genocide’ all over Pakistan but we are no one to label them a part of ISI or any other agency if they aren’t following the policies of LUBP on ‘Shia Genocide’.
I personally feel that labeling any individual or any organization a part of agencies that they are not affiliated with is a disgrace to our repute and also mislead the neutral masses towards analyzing in a way that has no relation with the reality. This will take us nowhere and create distances with the people who have liberal thoughts and working for a strengthened democratic Pakistan. There are very few people who are liberals and pro-democratic raising voice against Mullahs and if we confront with these voices, we’ll be loosing grounds.
Wow! Can’t tell whether this is an apology, a U-turn or a sell out.
As far as JI is concerned, when you appoint a Shia- and Baloch-hating Army suck-up as the head of your think tank, which by the way is notorious for peddling the obscurantist and unrealistic strategic analyses that are favoured by our miltary establishment, you are frankly pasting the label on your bloody faces. No need for anyone else to force it on them when they’re virtually asking for it…and are proud of it privately, for all we know!
Ravez: I am a LUBP wallah and proud to be a part of it. Saying this post a sell-out, U-turn or whatever has no facts. This is a fact based article which neither goes against LUBP not against any other. So better try to accept the reality instead of pinching out baseless points from this post. I tried to resolve issues because I am not one to give stupid ideas to abdul or any other editor and also I would like to highlight LUBP’s principles of Freedom of Speech. Here every co-editor and author have his/her own POV. Try to accept the realities I know it hurts but it also hurt others who’re not those which you label them.
Shocking!
Never thought Farhad would become Ejaz Haider’s spokesperson! By the way, has he read EH’s latest shitbag of an article?
Marvi is Farhad’s Boss in the UNDP project – she must be a marvellous boss – my people would not defend me like this.
Btw LUBP has highlighted JI not only cause of its silence on Shias but also much more ferociously on the end game in Afghanistan and being a party to Pashtuns’ “genocide” therefore mocking at LUBP on the Shia bit is a little too unfair and presents another dimension of our biases.
LUBP has always stood up for the rights of all – not just shias, therefore I find this post demeaning to say the least. One should learn to accept difference of opinion not discourage it by a self righteous approach. There will always be differences and friction – and that is what keeps the debate going and alive. I was also silenced on many occassions by use of coercive statements “we didn’t expect this from you” – what do u expect from me – toe your line, not challenge you, not critisize, not give my opinion, not make a bloody ‘mistake’ also – be a godess who is always right and always nice. I would rather not be one and be happier to bear criticism for not always being right.
Lastly the only thing I find true and like about this post is it says “this post doesn’t go against LUBP” 😀
From now on, no post will be deleted from LUBP including this post. It was very distasteful to see two critical posts removed from LUBP in the last few days. As they say if you can’t stand the heat, you must not visit the kitchen. All editors and authors please note.
Personally, I don’t agree with Farhad’s present post in which a previous LUBP post has been unwittingly misrepresented (particularly the ‘fact’ that LUBP termed Marvi as an ISI agent or that our only issue with the Jinnah Institute is Shia genocide).
There is also an element of conflict of interest which has been also highlighted by Salma Jafar.
However, I don’t think LUBP is so insecure that it can’s tolerate or publish divergent views on a topic.
Great to see people like salma jaffar criticizing one for highlighting facts. Salma’s comments aren’t related to the facts but just personal hatred. Whoever is farhad and whoever he is working for but the point he raised is valid. If I am not wrong this post concludes with a message of reconciliation which’s a policy of Shaheed Benazir Bhutto.
Oh! How can I forgot that Salma is a confused person. Her family is in pti and she always criticize PPP and leadership of PPP in abusive way. One can confirm this If I am wrong. One of her closed relative told me once when I met him on a seminar held in Karachi ‘Salma is a mad person don’t take her serious’.
Zara (mr or Miss) if u have the guts come out with ur real identity secondly my family is not in PTI ( so u don’t have correct info – even if someone is must be from my tribe – u people don’t know the difference between tribe and family tch tch) and why would I hate Farhad- u are the one giving personal comments and discussing me around with my so called close relatives!! ha “close relatives” this concept of close must be in your dictionary.
Just shows how threatened u feel. Btw hope u are not Farhad with another idi? Lolz – there was no need to take it personally.
by the way Mr/Ms . Zara – I like being called mad it is in my genes- and is my identity.
Ah! Look who’s saying fake 🙂 Ms. Salma Jafar I just know abdul nishapuri and sarah khan at lubp and read their articles often. About mr. farhad I would say that he might also be a fake id as it’s top priority of lubp to threat people using pen names. I admired lubp’s stance against judiciary, jang group and anti-ppp forces also the sane voice of lubp on shia killings. But the laibah and pak blogzine team is for sure a project of abdul nishapuri and his fake team.
I personally don’t know you or your relatives but I know a person who’s living in Islamabad and working on some project who told me all about you once we discussed pak blogzine at a youth seminar. That guy told me to keep him in anonymity while quoting this.
Anyway, fake bloggers saying fake to others 🙂 this is what everyone on twitter saying about LUBP that it’s not LUBP but LUDP. I wasn’t sure about this cheap behavior of you salma. You agreed with the term mad I used for you, that’s good. I hope the rest of comment will definitely judged by the readers of lubp.
I was wrong about Abdul, Sarah Khan, Farhad and Maula Bux. You all are fake cheapsters. Now I am blaming myself to get into such a mess by commenting on this blog. I will try my best to not get into this mess again and yes I’ll not stop reading posts in favor of PPP contributed by ppp loyalists. One more blog Pak Media Watch is doing excellent job but they aren’t MAD like you salma. Go analyze yourself before letting down any other. You r a Big tym Loozer
‘alright Mr. Farhad is a genuine id’ http://www.facebook.com/FarhadAhmedJarral I wasn’t sure about it but good to know if he’s a genuine id. Also the posts written by farhad jarral are all pro-ppp. I really liked it salma. What you’ve done for ppp? Please show me so I can admire your efforts too. All the jiyalas on fb and twitter are my beloved. Always heard shaizi cheema, elyas kakar, chahatiqbal, hyderleghari ada, banarisch bro, wamsha, saria supporting ppp but unfortunately you are just a paid employee of abdul. Was thinking how an org like UNDP hire you as consultant. Might be mistakenly or a parchi. MAD people are threat to Pakistan and you are MAD. Acha now I should be asleep before getting annoyed of replying you more. I expressed my all analysis also some real stories about you. Now you should take some pills which doctor prescribed you for situation when you get mad Sleep tight. Love : * xOxO
@Zara
We have given you freedom of speech, not freedom to tell lies.
Salma is NOT “a paid employee of abdul”.
Very immature attitude!
First of all I am thankful to Salma Jafar to show her auqaat by getting personal. Yes! I was a part of Marvi Sirmed’s organization but for your poor information Ms. Salma, I joined National Commission for Human Development earlier this month 🙂 Happy now?
Now come to the point. It’s a disrespect to me which you pointed out in your comment that I am Zara. Again for your poor information she’s a real id who added me last night after all this crap(your comments). Whatever she wrote about you is admirable because people like you deserve the same.
On your loyalties with PPP let me give a spotlight on our last meeting at your place in which I was defending President Asif Ali Zardari and PPP’s policies and you were the one who keeps on telling me that Imran Khan is a new hope and Zardari’s PPP is fail and all the disrespect for PPP and its leadership. Come on Ms. Salma grow up, you aren’t a kid anymore. Look at you and your comments. You openly said you are mad.
I will not respond a single comment of you now because it is useless to argue with a person who say herself a mad. NO? Get Well Soon!!
Zara: Thank you very much for your support. But I appreciate if you will contribute for LUBP in future as you are a regular visitor and reader of our blogzine!
Saying Salma a paid employee of abdul is where you went wrong. I know both of them and personally I feel Abdul is not an idiot to pay Salma cuz it’s such a wastage of money. hope you got my point!
Abdul:
You said “We have given you freedom of speech, not freedom to tell lies.”
FREEDOM TO LIES also imply on you when you wrote article mentioning anyone an ISI agent without facts. If you have facts i.e. some photo, video or audio clip, document <> then do criticize or bash anyone whether Marvi, Raza, Sherry Rehman or Jinnah Institute but if you publish articles without facts and those articles just based on your personal analysis which says all these aboved mentioned persons or organization are ISI paid is your ‘FREEDOM TO TELL LIE’.
I know my comments will hurt you but if we think in same way, such comments and posts also hurt those who are attacked by LUBP. This is not the way out my friend!
Your efforts and struggle to make this blog a known blog are being ruined by such posts.. Hope things would be resolved in a good way, I just have HOPE!
@Farhad
You said to me “try to accept the reality instead of pinching out baseless points…” Mere pyaray bhai, I only commented on your statement that we shouldn’t label people as agents of such and such by saying that some individuals (in this case an org) has made every probable effort to label itself as such.
“I am not one to give stupid ideas to abdul or any other editor…” I never found any of what Mr Abdul Nishapuri wrote as stupid. At the most you could say that his allegations about establishment support were speculative. But then he always gave the circumstancial evidence that seemed to prove his allegations. Such ideas must have seemed stupid, however, to those who were targeted.
“Try to accept the realities I know it hurts but it also hurt others who’re not those which you label them.”
Again, if someone says the “kill and dump” policy of the establishment in Balochistan is the “response of the state” then what would you say about the ideological bent of mind of that person? The fact remains that Ejaz Haider is anti-Baloch, apparently anti-Shia/Hazara and was appointed by a traitorous PPP leader as the ED of her think tank, which as I said, had supported a re-engagement with the Taliban. The same Taliban whom our Chairperson condemns at every opportunity.
Mere pyare Bhai.. Read my comment for Abdul on labeling and especially the term ‘FREEDOM TO TELL LIE’ coined by Abdul himself. We need all the relevant things which are authentic to prove anyone right or wrong.
Secondly on your comments about Ms. Sherry Rehman.. Sherry is appointed as MNA from PPP Platform and became Minister.. Then she resigned on whatsoever reason, phir whatever she did to PPP is not my cup of tea. As a Jiyala I personally feel that the one who’s Co-Chairman and Chairman of PPP knows PPP, Love PPP and overall Lead PPP decides what is better and what is not for PPP. We aren’t an appointed office bearer or a Leader of PPP to criticize any leader who’s directly appointed at some post by the Leadership. It means we are directly criticizing PPP Leadership, Right? So, my believe and support is with the choice of PPP Leadership..
If you’re a critical PPP and even critical to Leadership of PPP you can criticize but I am here on LUBP to support PPP.
@Zara, Salma jee, Farhad & Nishapuri sb,
Comments on this post are getting unnecessarily personal. Zara I have seen Salma Jafar’s tweets. Never have I seen one where she’s abusing PPP. Next time if you do catch one such tweet, do post a screen cap so that your unsubstantiated and juvenile allegation can be treated seriously.
Our loyalty towards the PPP, and our advocacy for it on any social media platform, is judged by its recognition by our leaders who are also present on such platforms. The fact that Miss Bakhtawar Zardari is following Salma Jafar proves her loyalty and service to the PPP and its recognition by our leadership. Also, I am surprised you used the acronym LUDP which is used by the fake liberals on Twitter against this blog. It appears your views have been influenced by their spin doctoring and lies about this blog.
@Farhad
“she resigned on whatsoever reason, phir whatever she did to PPP is not my cup of tea.”
Aha! That REASON was the PPP GOVT’s RESPONSE to negative media campaign during the Lawyers Movement when one news channel was busy in churning out propaganda against this govt. As I recall, she resigned to protest the moving of that channel to the outer channel range by PEMRA or its blocking or something. You talk of the opinions of our leaders right? I remember to date President Zardari’s words at that time that those who left PPP became redundant like GM Khar and Jatoi. Sherry Rehman owes her resurgence to the Army in return for the wonderful JI report she wrote supporting engagement with the Taliban in Afghanistan i.e. peddling the Army’s narrative.
Also, Farhad, our leadership isn’t a one-man show like PTI. Our leadership accepts all kinds of criticism and works on it. Remember when they were putting in two local govt systems in Sindh and there was a HUGE outcry? President Zardari cancelled that decision THE VERY NEXT DAY. We are proud of this leadership brother 🙂
That’s what I was saying… Yes we should be proud of this Leadership and its decisions 🙂
Abdul Nishapuri – if this is the criteria of editors in your blog then it’s a pity who are just lying, insulting and abusing people – It needs to be changed please.
Though I don’t want to further waste my time and yes ofcourse Imran Khan is a new hope this is a fact and what’s wrong with saying that and PPP has failed in Balochistan is always my argument so talking about my criticism without context is the height of intellectual dishonesty- I am in any case not a PPP memmber or worker so what’s the point being made here?
If people think Rehman Malaik is “PPP leadership” it’s for such chamchas not for me. It’s these sychophants who are damaging PPP by pretending to eb “jiyalas” and self proclaiming we are Jiyalas when no other thinks they are. Whatever my criticism of PPP I say it openly am not like Farhad who will only release APP news and consider he is doing activism for PPP – (he has actually damaged PPP through such low rated social media usage) – I don’t have any such ambition ND. Have heard from others also his need and ambition and will say what I consider wrong about PPP.
Btw for records sake I didn’t write anything against the chairman’s speech 😉 everyone knows Farhad did and that’s the criticism of the real “PPP leadership”
So he is not getting with this “real” lol Zara who knows a salma commenting on LUBP ought to be Salma Jafar; only an editor on LUBP would know that.
BTW you guys don’t understand the madness of Pashtuns and look at the dictionary to find its meaning I pity your tunnel vision.
And who is this Zara ?? she can scream her head off – am not even gonna respond to her.
People need to understand use of pen names by rights activists and fake idis that come into existence only to insult and abuse.
Abdul please take note of your editor’s misbehavior it reflects very badly on LUBP.
Now I can see the burn and feel that if the comments having facts are causing burn then it might be a way to realize how other feel when you portray them negative plus without facts.
Keep on crying! 🙂
and u keep on sucking up to your bosses – and ex bosses –
A humble request to all: When we indulge in personal, ad hominem comments, we lose the essence of our arguments.
Farhad: Please air your concerns about LUBP’s policies at the appropriate forum (ie editorial board).
Let’s focus our attention on the main topic of this post, i.e., Jinnah Institute and its directors and affiliates, and the pro-establishment (or is that anti-establishment?) discourse which is being continuously published by the Jinnah Institute.
But Abdul if you look at the comments in sequence u know who started getting personal – then it becomes inevitable not to show these people their own real faces also. I am sorry to LUBP if I also uttered a few personal comments in response to the one who got highly HIGHLY personal with me by creating a fake idi also. But they did this intentionally to take the discourse away from the real issue.
I again protest that this is being done by a LUBP editor; were it someone else it wouldn’t have mattered. Does LUBP have an ethics policy for its editors? It should because this is what it advocates for in the mainstream media!!
From Twitter:
Abdul Nishapuri @AbdulNishapuri
#LUBP has no intention to bow down to direct & indirect pressure by office bearers and affiliates of the pro-army Jinnah Institute.
#LUBP does not recognize pseudo-liberal thugs of the Jinnah Institute as liberals or progressives. No question of unity with them!
“Unity of liberals” is a dishonest tactic & discourse by pseudo-liberals in order to censor & suppress critical voices.
Clearly several ‘liberals’ who used to honestly criticize Jinnah Institute have either joined JI or become silent. Do we need to name them? Shame all around!
Yawn. Relieved to see that Mr. Jarral has finally caught on to LUDP rubbish. Cheers to him and Zahra for slamming these idiots! I invite LUDP readers to come over to PTH (thats Pak Tea House) and dump PPP for real parties like PML N and PTI.
Come to PTH and you will see that PTI and PML N have better liberal representatives than these rabid, grammatically-challenged LUDP-wallas.
Hey Manto Lives, whats with this PTH? What’s it stand for? Pure Tatti House?! Hahah see, I didn’t even have to change its initials to make it sound shitty! Hahah.
Grow some balls and use your real name the next time you comment on here. Capisce, shit for brains?!
Brilliant piece, Farhad! Good to see this sense of maturity.
My view is that the overriding message of the JI report was disturbing; my articles were based on quotes pulled directly from the Jinnah Institute report that clearly show a bias towards the ISI/ Pak Army cozy relationships with Quetta Shura and Tehrik-e-Taliban (TTP), and Pakistan’s arrogant determination to insert itself into Afghanistan decision-making (caveat: I also didn’t agree with the U.S. policy of inserting itself into Afghan politics, nor President Hamid Karzai, who is unpopular and seen as a US puppet- Afghans must have self-determination, regardless of outcome).
As for a person’s association with JI- There are friends of mine on the board- I don’t know whether being on the board constitutes alignment with every facet of the report, certainly there must be dissenters that did not agree with the final report, perhaps I am wrong about this- I simply don’t know as minutes of the meeting are not available. If I ever have misconstrued Marvi Sirmed as pro-establishment merely for joining the organization, I am rethinking that. She has been a voice of progressive “democracy supporter” in the past- perhaps a closer look at her views now are in order.
In light of this, one might need to be careful to color everyone that becomes associated with the JI or the JI Report with the same view – I, myself included, might need to be careful not to assume everyone held the same establishment view. There was an extensive list of contributors-did they all agree in one unanimous voice? I would doubt that. But the overall conclusions were pro-PakArmy/ISI/establishment.
Relevant LUBP Walker essays on JI report:
Part I- September 21, 2011
http://criticalppp.com/archives/57762
Part II- September 28, 2011
http://criticalppp.com/archives/58267
What’s up, how’s it going? Just shared this post with a colleague, we had a good laugh.
Excellent read, I just passed this onto a colleague who was doing some research on that. And he actually bought me lunch as I found it for him smile Thus let me rephrase that: Thanks for lunch! “By nature, men are nearly alike by practice, they get to be wide apart.” by Confucius.
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